Aquaponics Digest - Wed 09/01/99
Message 1: Re: Plastic cover, toxic?
from Bagelhole1
Message 2: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 3: Chlorine for post-harvest handling
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 4: Re: Parsley
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 5: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
from Marc & Marcy
Message 6: RE: Chlorine for post-harvest handling
from Conrad von Zirkwitz
Message 7: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 8: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from Bagelhole1
Message 9: RE: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from Jones Nick A PSNS
Message 10: Re: RE: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from Bagelhole1
Message 11: RE: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
from "Robert Vitale"
Message 12: RE: RE: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from Jones Nick A PSNS
Message 13: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 14: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
from "Claude Gelinas"
Message 15: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
from "Claude Gelinas"
Message 16: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from "grizzly"
Message 17: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from "William Brown"
Message 18: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
from Bagelhole1
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Subject: Re: Plastic cover, toxic?
From: Bagelhole1
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 01:37:07 EDT
In a message dated 9/1/99 5:13:45 AM, levysam@hotmail.com writes:
<>
Sam, thanks for responding about the how do you know if the plastic lining
for the trenches is toxic question, but one, why do you not feed the fish and
two, I'm thinking that the sun's reaction with the plastic over time is what
might cause some toxic release in the water.
Tom O
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Subject: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 06:18:38 -0400
Another alternative is to add chlorine tot he wash water. I got a
publication from the local extension service which gives the dilution
for different strengths of chlorine.. The chlorine's effectiveness is
gradually reduced as it comes in contact with organic matter so it is
important to test the water regularly as you are processing to ensure
that it is still in the solution.
I know that for salad greens you can rinse them in water and then spin
them dry in washing machine which has a removable center spindle. If
you have the product in mesh bags you will reduce the handling
requirements.
Browning in basil is related to temperature, it should be kept no lower
than 50 degrees fahrenheit. Other herbs are not quite so sensitive.
Once again, for salad greens, the single most important processing step
which contributes to its shelf life is the cooling of the greens to the
lowest acceptable temperature within one hour of harvest. Cold wash
water is one way to cool it down quickly. If you have a walk in cooler
you can fashion some sort of tunnel with a standard fan on one end. Put
the product in the tunnel, mist it lightly, close it up and turn the fan
on. By pulling the cold air through the product you will cool it down
much faster than with passive cooling.
Adriana Gutierrez
> Will herbs be shipped dried? or fresh? I would think food grade
> hydrogen peroxide in the wash water would be good, maybe also packed in
> Nitrogen atmosphere to reduce oxidation-keep fresher..
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Subject: Chlorine for post-harvest handling
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 07:15:00 -0400
I came across a research article on contamination of produce called
produce Handling and Processing Practices by Larry Beuchat and Jee-Hoon
Ryu. The URL is
http://www.medscape.com/govmt/CDC/EID/1997/v03.n04/e0304.05.beuc/e0304.05.be
uc.html#Sou
(you will probably have to register for free to access the information)
Here are some interesting notes:
As noted by Barmore[27], no
chlorine substitute effective for washing fruits and vegetables is
available. Numerous alternatives for sanitizing equipment (28)
can be used in a total sanitation program, but none has as broad
a spectrum of activity as chlorine.
Chlorine is routinely used as a sanitizer in wash, spray, and flume
waters used in the fresh fruit and vegetable industry.
Antimicrobial activity depends on the amount of free available
chlorine (as hypochlorous acid) in water that comes in contact
with microbial cells. The efficacy of chlorine in killing pathogenic
microorganisms has been extensively studied. Possible uses in
packinghouses and during washing, cooling, and transport to
control postharvest diseases of whole produce have been
reviewed by Eckert and Ogawa[29]. The effect of chlorine
concentration on aerobic microorganisms and fecal coliforms on
leafy salad greens was studied by Mazollier[30]. Total counts
were markedly reduced with increased concentrations of
chlorine up to 50 ppm, but a further increase in concentration up
to 200 ppm did not have an additional substantial effect. A
standard procedure for washing lettuce leaves in tap water was
reported to remove 92.4% of the microflora[31]. Including 100
ppm available free chlorine in wash water reduced the count by
97.8%. Adjusting the pH from 9 to 4.5 to 5.0 with inorganic and
organic acids resulted in a 1.5- to 4.0-fold increase in
microbicidal effect. Increasing the washing time in hypochlorite
solution from 5 to 30 minutes did not decrease microbial levels
further, whereas extended washing in tap water produced a
reduction comparable to hypochlorite. The addition of 100 ppm
of a surfactant (Tween 80) to a hypochlorite washing solution
enhanced lethality but adversely affected sensory qualities of
lettuce.
.
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Subject: Re: Parsley
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 09:12:58 -0500
At 03:37 PM 08/31/1999 -0400, you wrote:
>Paula,
>I grow lovage in my terrestrial garden. This is used as a celery substitute
>in most recipies. Is the same as leaf celery?
>Wendy
>
Sorry for taking so long - had to go back to my catalogs. It's so seldom I
think about the "official" names of plants - thanks for the reminder.
Lovage (Levisticum officinale) is probably what you've grown, while the
"leaf celery" I mentioned is (Apium graveolens), variously called "Par-Cel"
and "Cutting Celery" in the Cook's Garden catalog, and "Amsterdam Fine
Seasoning Celery (Apium graveolens - Dutch)" in the Shepherds Garden Seeds
catalog. Our seed was purchased from Shepherds, and I'll give you their
description.
"Biennial. Amsterdam Fine celery has long graceful fronds of crisp, vivid
green leaves that look like glossy, big-leaved Italian parsley. It's a
marvelous culinary plant, grown for its savory, intensely celery-flavored
leaves. Used in everyday cooking in Germany, Belgium and Holland, this leaf
celery deserves more attention from American kitchen gardeners. Fresh or
dried, its aromatic leaves add a rich mellow undercurrent of flavor than
enhances all other ingredients. Leaves are easy to air-dry (or use a
microwave) and do not lose their flavor. Best of all, Amsterdam Fine is
ready to pick when stalk celery is sky-high in price. A cook's secret, the
little touch that elevates every dish you prepare."
Well, that's the description - a little high on the "sales" side, but I must
admit the cream of celery soup I prepared with it was very well received.
Paula
S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
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Subject: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
From: Marc & Marcy
Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 08:59:31 -0600
Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta wrote:
>
> Another alternative is to add chlorine tot he wash water. I got a
> publication from the local extension service which gives the dilution
> for different strengths of chlorine..
..snip..
Adrianna,
Does the publication address whether or not the chlorine
strength measured is TOTAL or FREE? I ask this cause this
is such a very big deal it can get a water supply system
(city water) actually shut down by the health department if
the FREE chlorine is too low. Some test kits measure FREE,
some measure TOTAL and some do both.
Marc
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Subject: RE: Chlorine for post-harvest handling
From: Conrad von Zirkwitz
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 11:03:36 -0700
Have you seen this site yet: http://www.kesmist.com
Conrad
-----Original Message-----
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
[mailto:gutierrez-lagatta@home.com]
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 1999 4:15 AM
To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
Subject: Chlorine for post-harvest handling
I came across a research article on contamination of produce called
produce Handling and Processing Practices by Larry Beuchat and Jee-Hoon
Ryu. The URL is
http://www.medscape.com/govmt/CDC/EID/1997/v03.n04/e0304.05.beuc/e0304.05.be
uc.html#Sou
(you will probably have to register for free to access the information)
Here are some interesting notes:
As noted by Barmore[27], no
chlorine substitute effective for washing fruits and vegetables is
available.
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Subject: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 14:22:27 -0400
Marc,
I'll check the publication tomorrow when I go back to the greenhouse.
AG
> Does the publication address whether or not the chlorine
> strength measured is TOTAL or FREE?
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Subject: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: Bagelhole1
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 14:35:55 EDT
Last call, I gotta go buy plastic to line the raceway for the tilapia, in a
few minutes. I'm hoping that plastic will be alright for the fish and that
the sun won't cause any slow type of toxic release into the water. Orchard
Supply says they can't tell if the 10 mil plastic is toxic or not. Anyone
know how to tell?
Thanks,
Tom O
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Subject: RE: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: Jones Nick A PSNS
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 11:57:39 -0700
Tom,
Most packaging will indicate who manufactured the item, or
in this case, plastic film, it may even give a toll free phone number to
call. I would give the manufacturer a call if possible, or an email to them
should steer you in the right direction. You may be able to call the
manufacturer from Orchard Supply.
nick
-----Original Message-----
From: Bagelhole1 [mailto:Bagelhole1]
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 1999 11:36 AM
To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
Subject: How do you tell if plastic liner may be
toxic or not?
Last call, I gotta go buy plastic to line the raceway for
the tilapia, in a
few minutes. I'm hoping that plastic will be alright for the
fish and that
the sun won't cause any slow type of toxic release into the
water. Orchard
Supply says they can't tell if the 10 mil plastic is toxic
or not. Anyone
know how to tell?
Thanks,
Tom O
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Subject: Re: RE: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: Bagelhole1
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 15:06:42 EDT
In a message dated 9/1/99 7:58:25 PM, jonesn@psns.navy.mil writes:
<< Tom,
Most packaging will indicate who manufactured the item, or
in this case, plastic film, it may even give a toll free phone number to
call. I would give the manufacturer a call if possible, or an email to them
should steer you in the right direction. You may be able to call the
manufacturer from Orchard Supply.
nick
>>
Thanks Nick for your quick response, but unfortunately, I already asked for
that and tried that, but was unable to locate the company, Wrap Brothers from
Chicago to ask them.
Regards,
Tom O
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Subject: RE: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
From: "Robert Vitale"
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 15:17:59 -0700
If you have a choice between Chlorine of Food Grade Hydrogen Peroxide the
peroxide is far the better choice.
Bob Vitale
-----Original Message-----
From: aquaponics
[mailto:aquaponics] On Behalf Of Adriana Gutierrez &
Dennis LaGatta
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 1999 3:19 AM
To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
Subject: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
Another alternative is to add chlorine tot he wash water. I got a
publication from the local extension service which gives the dilution
for different strengths of chlorine.. The chlorine's effectiveness is
gradually reduced as it comes in contact with organic matter so it is
important to test the water regularly as you are processing to ensure
that it is still in the solution.
Adriana Gutierrez
> Will herbs be shipped dried? or fresh? I would think food grade
> hydrogen peroxide in the wash water would be good, maybe also packed in
> Nitrogen atmosphere to reduce oxidation-keep fresher..
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Subject: RE: RE: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: Jones Nick A PSNS
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 12:14:48 -0700
Tom,
You might check the spelling of the business name, there is
a:
Warp Brothers in Chicago and their number is:
773-261-5200
nick
Thanks Nick for your quick response, but unfortunately, I
already asked for
that and tried that, but was unable to locate the company,
Wrap Brothers from
Chicago to ask them.
Regards,
Tom O
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Subject: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 15:33:18 -0400
Hi Tom,
Find out from Orchard Supply the name of the manufacturer and call them
directly. Home Aquaculture, A Guide to Backyard Fish Farming,
recommends 16 mil plastic and specifies that the liner should not be
treated with fungicides. If I were you I would buy something
specifically designated as a "pond liner", that way it shouldn't be
toxic for fish. Walmart sells them in our area. Home Aquaculture also
suggests that you precondition the liner before using it for fish
culture. Fill the pond or pool or tank to the rim with water and let it
stand for several days in temperatures over 70 degrees. "Adding organic
material such as dirt, peat moss or manure further enhances the
conditioning process. After a few days the water should be removed and
new water added." ..."If a pond or stream is available simply submerge
the liner under water for a few days."
Good luck, Adriana
Bagelhole1 wrote:
>
> Last call, I gotta go buy plastic to line the raceway for the tilapia, in a
> few minutes. I'm hoping that plastic will be alright for the fish and that
> the sun won't cause any slow type of toxic release into the water. Orchard
> Supply says they can't tell if the 10 mil plastic is toxic or not. Anyone
> know how to tell?
> Thanks,
> Tom O
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Subject: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
From: "Claude Gelinas"
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 20:03:23 +0000
To give more precision,
Herbs will be shipped fresh and must be keept as fresh as possible for as=
long
as possible.
Thank you,
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Subject: Re: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
From: "Claude Gelinas"
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 20:38:34 +0000
On Sep 1, 3:17pm, Robert Vitale wrote:
> Subject: RE: Herbs post-harvest cleaning
> If you have a choice between Chlorine of Food Grade Hydrogen Peroxide t=
he
> peroxide is far the better choice.
>
> Bob Vitale
>
Do you have info about the use of Hydrogen Peroxide, concentration in wa=
ter,
how long it should stay on leave etc.
also I've found some information about the use of methyl dihydro jasmonat=
e to
reduce micro-organism on leaf and also to slow the aging process of the p=
lant.
That product come from a plant extract and is supposed to be safe to use.=
Does
anybody have some experience with that product.
Claude
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Subject: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: "grizzly"
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 18:11:39 -0400
I believe it is O.K. as long as it not chemically treated to prevent
condensation,the safest way would be to contact the manufacturer.
-----Original Message-----
From: Bagelhole1
To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
Date: Wednesday, September 01, 1999 2:35 PM
Subject: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
>Last call, I gotta go buy plastic to line the raceway for the tilapia, in a
>few minutes. I'm hoping that plastic will be alright for the fish and that
>the sun won't cause any slow type of toxic release into the water. Orchard
>Supply says they can't tell if the 10 mil plastic is toxic or not. Anyone
>know how to tell?
> Thanks,
> Tom O
>
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Subject: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: "William Brown"
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 12:47:31 -1000
Would like to know the answer myself about plastic as I use it too. Also
available is potable water vinyl pond liners. Don't use regular pool liners
as most of them have anti-fungal chemicals impregnated in the vinyl.
William Brown mahiwai@cmpmail.com
> > Last call, I gotta go buy plastic to line the raceway for the tilapia,
in a
> > few minutes. I'm hoping that plastic will be alright for the fish and
that
> > the sun won't cause any slow type of toxic release into the water.
Orchard
> > Supply says they can't tell if the 10 mil plastic is toxic or not.
Anyone
> > know how to tell?
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Subject: Re: How do you tell if plastic liner may be toxic or not?
From: Bagelhole1
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 22:10:46 EDT
Dear Adriana,
Thanks for your quick and relevant advice, right on. Tom O
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