Aquaponics Digest - Mon 09/13/99
Message 1: Re: Let Nature Reign
from Jim Sealy Jr
Message 2: Re: Let Nature Reign
from Bagelhole1
Message 3: Re: Re: Re: Evaporative cooling
from
Message 4: Re: Free Guide to Building a Cooler!!!!
from
Message 5: Re: Let Nature Reign
from
Message 6: Re: Let Nature Reign
from Bagelhole1
Message 7:
from
Message 8: Re: Evaporative cooling
from Ronald Polka
Message 9: I want to join your discussion group
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 10: Re: I want to join your discussion group
from
Message 11: Re: I want to join your discussion group
from Ronald Polka
Message 12: Tliapia permits
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 13: Re: I want to join your discussion group
from Mike Strates
Message 14: Re: Re: I want to join your discussion group
from "Wendy Nagurny"
Message 15: Re:
from "Wendy Nagurny"
Message 16: tilapia
from Kevin Hopkins
Message 17: Re: I want to join your discussion group
from "Jewel Lopez"
Message 18: Re: tilapia
from "Wendy Nagurny"
Message 19: Re: I want to join your discussion group
from "TGTX"
Message 20: Re: Need off grid advice
from "William Brown"
Message 21: Re: Need off grid advice
from "William Brown"
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| Message 1 |
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Subject: Re: Let Nature Reign
From: Jim Sealy Jr
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 00:32:00 -0500
Hi Tom,
I've been unbelieveably busy these last 3 months so have been lurking
and reading posts about once a week. This post caught my eye because
you've described something fairly close to your standard issue managed
farm pond mix around here. That being sunfish, catfish, crawfish, etc
(frogs, snails, snakes, and whatever the birds drop off. ;) Are you
still thinking of feeding people with this or just as a demonstration
project? If for demonstration purposes, there's one very similar to your
description at the Memphis Fargrounds which is self supporting at about
10,000 gallons arranged as a series of raceways decorated to resemble a
creek.
In a farm pond, a good mix would be 100 channel catfish and 350-500
hybrid sunfish per surface acre with a depth of 3 - 6 feet. The accepted
carrying level is 500 lbs per acre without supplemental feeding and
aeration. But keep in mind these numbers don't scale down well.
Since we have the gear to do it, we're often called in (by folks
wanting to hold a fish fry) to seine a farm pond. The owners are almost
always seriouly disappointed to learn just how few catfish their small
ponds contain.
Jim
Working 8 days a week... Ok, OK, 5 days and 3 nights a week, but I only
work 26 hrs straight on Mon-Tue and Thur-Fri.. Geez, I'll be glad when
this is over.
Bagelhole1 wrote:
>
> Fellow Fish Lovers,
> Now, we are thinking of making the raceway into an
> eco-environment, with snails, plants, insects and fish, so we don't have to
> feed the fish. Am contemplating tilapia with catfish, crayfish, and shrimp,
> what do you think? Today, we added plants, minnows and things from the
> Russian river (donated by the saintly Noche, ambassador of sustainability).
> But I'm still looking for some affordable tilapia halfgrown, or will they eat
> everything up?
> Moving along
> slowly,
> Tom O
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Subject: Re: Re: Re: Evaporative cooling
From:
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 8:38:54 + 5 EST
Frank,
Will do my best.....
All old "window style" AC units have two coils in them - a coil which is
cooled down which a fan
blows across and spreads cool air into a room and another that "heats up" to
draft hot air out. May
take some creative plumbing/heating work to do what we had said. The cold
coil (in water) will cool
the water and the warm one will warm the heat sink or other fish takn.
Would be glad to send you a
few jpeg pics once we are up and running this winter!
Mike
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Subject: Re: Free Guide to Building a Cooler!!!!
From:
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 8:44:00 + 5 EST
sorry to give you info that I can't guarantee will work for you. Actually,
we are in the process of
building the greenhouse right now. We do not use this "technology" for
heating/cooloing our gh,
but rather for our fish tanks only. Sorry if i lead you to believe otherwise!
Mike
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| Message 5 |
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Subject: Re: Let Nature Reign
From:
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 8:46:48 + 5 EST
Cheap tilapia? dont know wqhat to tell you. I would check with local
universities to see who is
doing aquaculture. they are a fairly widely available species!
Mike
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Subject: Re: Let Nature Reign
From: Bagelhole1
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 12:29:56 EDT
Dear Jim,
Thanks for your very informative reply. This project is both to
supply food for me and my friends and neighbors and as a demonstration model,
to help others do the same thing, and move toward "community food security".
Making communities independent of outside food sources (other than grains).
Is there a website or e-mail for the Memphis Fairground project?
Kind Regards,
Tom O
In a message dated 9/13/99 6:30:37 AM, jimsealyjr@who.net writes:
<
> Fellow Fish Lovers,
> Now, we are thinking of making the raceway into an
> eco-environment, with snails, plants, insects and fish, so we don't have to
> feed the fish. Am contemplating tilapia with catfish, crayfish, and shrimp,
> what do you think? Today, we added plants, minnows and things from the
> Russian river (donated by the saintly Noche, ambassador of sustainability).
> But I'm still looking for some affordable tilapia halfgrown, or will they
eat
> everything up?
> Moving along
> slowly,
> Tom O
>>
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Subject:
From:
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 13:30:44 + 5 EST
Anyone know where I can get catfish fingerlings somewhere in or around NY
state to run as a
polyculture with Tilapia in my system???
Mike
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| Message 8 |
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Subject: Re: Evaporative cooling
From: Ronald Polka
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 11:50:38 -0600
At 11:34 PM 9/10/1999 -0400, you wrote:
>Hi,I have a few ideas on this subject,first on your shade cloth,if you will
>leave a space between the cloth and your poly it will reduce heat gain thru
>convection. Second,instead of using misters inside your greenhouse,run the
>misters inside the dead air space between layers of poly,that way you can
>cool the air around your greenhouse without increasing the humidity,the heat
>inside the greenhouse will transfer to the cooler air inside the dead air
A word on continually introducing water into the air space of the double
poly envelope. There may be two problems associated with this, a moist
environment in the inflated poly layer may lead to growth of algae which
would be a real hassle and lower light transmission. Secondly the long term
use of water in the envelope may also lead to mineral deposits on the
inside of the plastic, again leading to decreased light transmission. With
double poly houses the standared installation practice is to hook up the
inflation blower with the inlet side of the fan attached at a clothes dryer
vent hose that leads to the outside air. This reduces the humidity level of
the air that is being blown into the envelope, thereby lowering
condensation within the envelope itself. This condensation has to be
allowed to drain out in order to prevent the problems described above.
Ron Polka
Southwest Technology Development Institute
New Mexico State University
Box 30001, Dept 3SOL
Las Cruces, NM 88003
rpolka@nmsu.edu
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Subject: I want to join your discussion group
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 13:11:16 -0500
>I live in Salt Lake City, Utah, and I know that at one time it was
>illegal to keep any kind of Tilapia in the state. I heard the Utah State
>government was debating the issue and was possibly going to rescind the
>law. I never heard what happened and that was 3 years ago.
>
>If you know whether or not this law is still in effect, I would
>appreciate it if you would let me know.
>
>Thanks,
>Bart Payne
S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
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Subject: Re: I want to join your discussion group
From:
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 14:17:22 + 5 EST
Really?????????
Never heard of tilapia being "illegal" for any state, but I guess anything
is possible. I would contact
your local Cooperative Extension or Soil and Water Conservation District to
get details!!!
Mike
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| Message 11 |
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Subject: Re: I want to join your discussion group
From: Ronald Polka
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 14:14:35 -0600
At 02:17 PM 9/13/1999 EST, you wrote:
>Really?????????
>
>Never heard of tilapia being "illegal" for any state, but I guess anything
is possible. I would contact
>your local Cooperative Extension or Soil and Water Conservation District
to get details!!!
>Mike
>
In New Mexico Tilapia possession is strictly regulated. A special use
permit is required for anyone interested in raising them in an aquaculture
setup. Ciclids are legal in the aquarium trade but not the larger Tilapia
species that are grown for aquaculture. The first tilapia permit in the
state was issued to my facility at NM State Univ. It was for research only
and was tightly controlled. To this day I am still not allowed top remove
live fish from the site, only dead iced ones. There is one other permit
issued in the state at this time and that is for a grower who specializes
in selling tilapia fingerlings. The rational behind this tight control of
the species is the state's concern that tilapia may be accidentally
released and displace native fish. In the past the state fish and wildlife
service has been burned by the release and unforseen expansion of other
exotics within the state such as the Oryx on White Sands Missile Range and
the Ibex in the Florida Mountains. For six years now we have been trying to
convince the fish and wildlife dept that tilapia cannot survive the winter
water temps in New Mexico, even the southern waters get too cold for
tilapia to overwinter. What we have seen in NM is that when a business
person has expressed an interest in changing the status quo the state
bureaucracy will begin to move, all be it slowly in a direction toward
accommodating the commercial sector.
Ron Polka
Southwest Technology Development Institute
New Mexico State University
Box 30001, Dept 3SOL
Las Cruces, NM 88003
rpolka@nmsu.edu
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Subject: Tliapia permits
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 16:32:18 -0400
Mike,
Here in Florida there are only 4 species allowed. The ones that have
become "naturalized don't require a permit; for the others you do. "Up
North" things might not be as restrictive since cold weather kills them
off before the invade and displace the native species.
Adriana
> Never heard of tilapia being "illegal" for any state, but I guess anything
is possible.
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Subject: Re: I want to join your discussion group
From: Mike Strates
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 07:34:35 +1000
On Mon, Sep 13, 1999 at 02:17:22PM +0000, MCOMET@south-lewis.moric.org wrote:
> Never heard of tilapia being "illegal" for any state, but I guess anything
is possible. I would contact
> your local Cooperative Extension or Soil and Water Conservation District
to get details!!!
In some states of Australia, Tilapia are illegal ... they were once here;
but idiots released them into our rivers and they multiplied, and
multiplied, and multiplied. Hence, the reason for the law.
I think Utah's law was brought about by the same occurance.
--
Mike "Skyfox" Strates ; www.croftj.net/~mstrates
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Subject: Re: Re: I want to join your discussion group
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 17:02:01 -0400
Many states prohibit the culture of species that can rapidly turn into pests
and destroy natural species populations and/or habitat if released into the
wild. Tilapia are prolific and aggressive. They fit pest specie
definitions. Many other places allow these species only in recirculating
systems that allow no effluent into native waters.
Wendy
>Really?????????
>
>Never heard of tilapia being "illegal" for any state, but I guess anything
is possible. I would contact
>your local Cooperative Extension or Soil and Water Conservation District to
get details!!!
>Mike
>
>
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Subject: Re:
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 17:02:14 -0400
How many? If you only want a few, most pet shop aquariums either stock or
can get channel cat fingerlings. They also make amusing pets. :-)
Wendy
>Anyone know where I can get catfish fingerlings somewhere in or around NY
state to run as a
>polyculture with Tilapia in my system???
>Mike
>
>
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Subject: tilapia
From: Kevin Hopkins
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 11:25:52 -1000
Dear People,
I am in the process of writing a review of the impacts of tilapias on
natural fish populations. If you know of any documented studies of these
impacts, I would greatly appreciate receiving the citation (i.e., author,
title and source of the paper/report). The issue of tilapia impacts is
much more complicated than just fish to fish interactions because tilapia
often thrive in highly disturbed environments. In those cases, what caused
the native fish decline: the disturbed environment or the tilapia?
Thanks for any leads.
Yours,
Kevin Hopkins
>Many states prohibit the culture of species that can rapidly turn into pests
>and destroy natural species populations and/or habitat if released into the
>wild. Tilapia are prolific and aggressive. They fit pest specie
>definitions. Many other places allow these species only in recirculating
>systems that allow no effluent into native waters.
>Wendy
>
>
***********************************************************
Kevin D. Hopkins
Professor of Aquaculture
College of Agriculture, Forestry & Natural Resources Management
University of Hawaii at Hilo
200 West Kawili Street
Hilo, Hawaii 96720
USA
Telephone (808) 974-7393
Fax (808) 974-7674
E-mail Hopkins@hawaii.edu
**********************************************************
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Subject: Re: I want to join your discussion group
From: "Jewel Lopez"
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 17:53:52 -0600
Does anyone know if there are Tilapia regs in Colorado?
Has anyone ever heard of doing aquaponics with native species, like trout?
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Subject: Re: tilapia
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 22:35:14 -0400
Kevin,
Try this site:
http://nas.er.usgs.gov/fishes/accounts/cichlida/or_aureu.html
Wendy
>Dear People,
>
>I am in the process of writing a review of the impacts of tilapias on
>natural fish populations. If you know of any documented studies of these
>impacts, I would greatly appreciate receiving the citation (i.e., author,
>title and source of the paper/report). The issue of tilapia impacts is
>much more complicated than just fish to fish interactions because tilapia
>often thrive in highly disturbed environments. In those cases, what caused
>the native fish decline: the disturbed environment or the tilapia?
>
>Thanks for any leads.
>
>Yours,
>Kevin Hopkins
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Subject: Re: I want to join your discussion group
From: "TGTX"
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 21:36:40 -0500
> Does anyone know if there are Tilapia regs in Colorado?
> Has anyone ever heard of doing aquaponics with native species, like trout?
Are Tilapia not native species to your planet?
Why trouble you so over these things?
Do. Or don't do.
Yoda.
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Subject: Re: Need off grid advice
From: "William Brown"
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 06:28:28 -1000
Pump head is defenitely the key. However pressure is 1psi for 2.31 feet of
height. So to get 30psi you need to go up 70 feet. Gravity feed is best
suited for free flow designs not requiring significant pressure.
William Brown mahiwai@cmpmail.com
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| Message 21 |
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Subject: Re: Need off grid advice
From: "William Brown"
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 06:22:51 -1000
I really should check my spelling I meant line pots. I took 3G pots and
lined them with plastic bags. I don't know why Tom had trouble with 12V
pumps, we use them quite extensively here on the Island of Hawaii. One
thing to watch out for is the material used for the seals. Be sure to get a
pump that can handle chemicals, usually with Viton seals.
William Brown mahiwai@cmpmail.com
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