Aquaponics Digest - Tue 10/26/99
Message 1: Strawberries????
from Robert WALKER
Message 2: RE: Technical greenhouse question
from "Robert Claytor"
Message 3: Re: Strawberries????
from William Evans
Message 4: Re: Slow leak, is spray ok?/ a little explanation.
from Bagelhole1
Message 5: [Fwd: FW: Developing New Vaccines to Prevent Fish Kills]
from William Evans
Message 6: Banana fruit production
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 7: Re: Technical greenhouse question
from Nelson and Pade
Message 8: Re: Technical greenhouse question
from "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Message 9: Re: JewelWeed
from "Wendy Nagurny"
Message 10: Re: Technical greenhouse question
from "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Message 11: Heirloom bananas
from "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Message 12: cold
from JB
Message 13: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
from "TGTX"
Message 14: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
from Marc & Marcy
Message 15: Re: cold
from "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Message 16: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
from "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Message 17: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
from Marc & Marcy
Message 18: Power Conservation
from Dave Miller
Message 19: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
from PDOSSJR
Message 20: Interesting Aquaculture Articles
from Marc & Marcy
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| Message 1 |
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Subject: Strawberries????
From: Robert WALKER
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 20:35:07 +1000
Hi,
I have just purchased a flood and drain system for strawberries
and I wish to place this into my aquaculture system.
Does any one have advice, mainly on the side of applying
the additional nutrients (iron, calcium, etc.) The other
area which needs to be addressed is the PH - my fish stock
is around 7.5, and strawberries prefer 6.5, any ideas????
Thanks,
Rob.
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Subject: RE: Technical greenhouse question
From: "Robert Claytor"
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 03:53:07 PDT
>From: "Ronald W. Brooks"
>Reply-To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
>To:
>Subject: RE: Technical greenhouse question
>Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 15:42:41 -0400
>
>
>Well I have to disagree
>
Wow ... thanks for that information..
One plant did flower last year, but it did appear to be a "male" flower.
The person who told me they were all males even described the phsysical
attributes of the leaves , telling me "too bad they are all males".
Guess when somebody acts like they know a lot about something you know
nothing about, you tend to believe them.
I am interested in any thing else you know about growing bananas. Since
they are growing in containers, I probably did not feed them enough,
although they were fifteen to twenty feet tall this year. We got our first
frost here in GA Saturday night , and they have bit it for the season.
thanks again
bc
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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Subject: Re: Strawberries????
From: William Evans
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 04:55:30 -0700
Strawbrerries dont like too much calcium they're "calciphobic"-little
goes a long way
>
I have just purchased a flood and drain system for strawberries
>
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Subject: Re: Slow leak, is spray ok?/ a little explanation.
From: Bagelhole1
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 11:44:13 EDT
In a message dated 10/17/99 11:00:30 PM, barrythomas@crosswinds.net writes:
<>
I am trying to create an eco-environment in the raceway under the greenhouse;
fish, clams (biofilter), waterhyacinth (clean water), crayfish, etc, to not
have to feed fish and to clean water naturally.
Hopefully,
Tom O
PS. I replaced the torn plastic with another plastic to stop the slow leak.
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Subject: [Fwd: FW: Developing New Vaccines to Prevent Fish Kills]
From: William Evans
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 08:52:01 -0700
>
> This item is one of the news releases and story leads that ARS Information
> distributes on weekdays to fax and e-mail subscribers. You can also get the
> latest ARS news on the World Wide Web at
> http://www.ars.usda.gov/is/pr/thelatest.htm.
> * For photos, media sources should contact ARS Photo Unit at (301) 504-1606
> or arsphoto@asrr.arsusda.gov.
> * Feedback and questions to ARS News Service via e-mail: isnv@ars-grin.gov.
> * ARS Information Staff, 5601 Sunnyside Ave., Room 1-2251, Beltsville MD
> 20705-5128, (301) 504- 1617, fax 504-1648.
> ----------
> From: "ARS News Service"
> To: "ARS News List"
> Subject: Developing New Vaccines to Prevent Fish Kills
> Date: Tue, Oct 26, 1999, 7:09 AM
>
> STORY LEAD:
> Developing New Vaccines to Prevent Fish Kills
>
> -----------
> ARS News Service
> Agricultural Research Service, USDA
> Tara Weaver-Missick, (301) 504-1619, tweaver@asrr.arsusda.gov
> October 26, 1999
> -----------
>
> Agricultural Research Service scientists in Auburn, Ala., are closing in on
> a vaccine that protects fish from a streptococcus bacterium. ARS is the U.S.
> Department of Agriculture's chief research agency.
>
> Streptococcus iniae is an emerging bacterial pathogen in cultivated tilapia,
> hybrid striped bass, rainbow trout, yellowtail, eel and turbot. Worldwide,
> streptococcal infections are reported in 22 species, both cultured and wild.
>
> S. iniae is recognized as one of the most problematic bacterial pathogens in
> intensively cultured tilapia and hybrid striped bass in the United States.
> The combination of development of good health management practices and a
> vaccine to control this bacterium is a superior approach to using
> antibiotics or chemicals, according to researchers at ARS' Aquatic Animal
> Health Research Laboratory.
>
> Antibiotics are currently used to control the streptococcal disease, which
> causes $150 million a year in losses worldwide.
>
> The streptococcus bacterium possibly enters the nares (noses) of hybrid
> striped bass and tilapia from the water. The higher the density of cultured
> fish, the more easily streptococcus is transmitted and the higher the
> mortality rate.
>
> Signs of the disease in fish are abnormal behavior, like erratic swimming,
> whirling motion at the surface of the water, darkening of the skin,
> blindness, pop-eyes and small lesions on the fish's body, fins and anus.
>
> ARS scientists are also researching fish behavior and health problems
> related to fungal, algal, bacterial and chemical toxins that have been
> implicated in fish kills in U.S. coastal waters.
>
> An in-depth article appears in the October issue of Agricultural Research
> magazine. The story is also on the World Wide Web:
>
> http://www.ars.usda.gov/is/AR/archive/oct99/fish1099.htm
>
> ----------
> Scientific contacts: Philip H. Klesius, ARS Aquatic Animal Health Research
> Laboratory, Auburn, Ala., phone (334) 887-3741, fax (334) 887-2983,
> klesiph@vetmed.auburn.edu.
> ----------
> This item is one of the news releases and story leads that ARS Information
> distributes on weekdays to fax and e-mail subscribers. You can also get the
> latest ARS news on the World Wide Web at
> http://www.ars.usda.gov/is/pr/thelatest.htm.
> * For photos, media sources should contact ARS Photo Unit at (301) 504-1606
> or arsphoto@asrr.arsusda.gov.
> * Feedback and questions to ARS News Service via e-mail: isnv@ars-grin.gov.
> * ARS Information Staff, 5601 Sunnyside Ave., Room 1-2251, Beltsville MD
> 20705-5128, (301) 504- 1617, fax 504-1648.
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Subject: Banana fruit production
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 11:53:43 -0400
I went to a meeting of our local Fruit and Nut Society ( I guess I
qualify as one of the nuts) this summer where the speaker was the
Tropical Fruit Curator for Fairchild Gardens in Miami. He said that
banana fruit production is directly correlated to the adequacy of
nutrients in the first three months of the plant's life...
Adriana
> I am interested in any thing else you know about growing bananas. Since
> they are growing in containers, I probably did not feed them enough,
> although they were fifteen to twenty feet tall this year.
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Subject: Re: Technical greenhouse question
From: Nelson and Pade
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 11:37:42 -0700
> I can send you some growing FAQ's private if you want.
Ron, I am interested in the banana FAQ's. Could you please send them to
me off-list?
Thanks,
Rebecca Nelson
Nelson/Pade Multimedia - Aquaponics Technology Center
http://www.aquaponics.com
phone - 209-742-6869 fax - 209-742-4402
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Subject: Re: Technical greenhouse question
From: "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 13:09:00 -0600
Hi Adriana, I haven't had time to keep up with the list lately, and I
haven't read all the responses you've gotten yet, but here's my two cents.
----- Original Message -----
> 2. Is there a way to run fans with solar power?
Jade mountain has solar vent fans, however they aren't up to the CFM that AC
powered fans are. We are going with those, but our location is cooler than
you, plus we are using the "pit " design to moderate temperature. The pit
design might be good for you if the water table is ok. The earth stays
about 55 degrees or so all year, creating a moderating factor, and a thermal
mass. Besides the pit, you can dig vent air ducts that run under the soil.
In our case, it warms the freezing air, in your case, it would cool the hot
air. Natural hot/cold induction can take some of the load of passive
ventilating more efficiently then.
Will sea air and
> extreme sunlight lead to a short life for the equipment and lots of
> headaches down the road?
After living on a boat for 3 years (which was from Sarasota!), and in
coastal areas for many more, I can definitely say YES the sea air shortens
the life of just about everything, some things quite dramatically. However,
it makes a huge diff if you are right on the water, right off shore, or
miles away. If your in a "salt air" rich zone, try to get electronics made
for marine applications, and use marine wiring techniques.
>
Jewel
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Subject: Re: JewelWeed
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 13:02:01 -0400
Charlie,
I was just packing the seeds, and I noticed I don't have your mailing
address (can't e-mail them ). If you send me your addy, I will be glad
to send you some jewelweed seed.
Wendy
>
>If anyone can supply me with a few extra seeds from the wild, I'll see how
>they grow here on the rock (St. Croix).
>
>Respects again,
>Charlie
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Subject: Re: Technical greenhouse question
From: "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 13:30:09 -0600
Hi Ginger,
We first got the idea for our pit greenhouses from some plans our mail order
company sells for a simple little greenhouse that is being used in northern
canada. It uses mirrored surfaces to reflect light down into it. But we
have hilly land, so the design we are using is based on one from Mike
Oehler's video seminar on earthsheltered housing, that had a section on a
pit greenhouse. He is the author of the $50 & up underground house book (he
really did make one for $50 bucks - primitive, but fascinating). He said he
grows tomatos through december with no heat, and he's near the canadian
border in Idaho! His design is quite small, so we had to modify it for our
3000 sq foot commercial applications. Since we aren't certain of it staying
warm enough for the fishies, we're going to use a solar hydronic system for
the Tilapia tanks as a back up - and that will be backed up by a wood
boiler.
Jewel
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Claytor
To:
Sent: Monday, October 25, 1999 6:25 AM
Subject: Re: Technical greenhouse question
> >Robert,
> >Where did you get the plans for your greenhouse? It sounds like one I
> >could
> >use
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Subject: Heirloom bananas
From: "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 15:56:17 -0600
Does anyone know of a source of Heirloom or non-hybrid banana =
seeds/seedlings? We ate some in Belize once - very different - small, =
orange, and sweet like a mango.
Jewel
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Subject: cold
From: JB
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 17:12:20 -0600
Hello Group
I live in Calgary, Alberta, Canada and am interested in starting an =
aquaponics system. I have purchased the package from S&S but am =
concerned with the viability of such a project in our harsh climate. =
Our temperatures can range from 30C in summer to -30C in winter. Hail =
is also a concern here. Is there anyone out there who has experience =
with this type of scenareo? Any info/insight would be appreciated!
Thanks,
jb
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Subject: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
From: "TGTX"
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 18:30:14 -0500
> I recently did a study on solar electricity for aquaponics
> pumping purposes. It is a viable and economical idea for an
> intermittent pumping system. We are implementing it here as
> we use the S&S paradigm which has an intermittent pumping
> system.
>
> A continuous duty battery operated fan/pumping/charging
> system cannot work unless you have photovoltaic capacity
> that can charge batteries AND run the fans simultaneously.
> This is a horrendously expensive system. I can operate on
> the power grid or company owned generator more profitably
> after amortization.
>
> A intermittent fan/pumping system can work with batteries if
> the photovoltaics can produce enough battery recharge to
> power your fans between fan cycles. Significantly fewer
> photovoltaics than the continuously run system.
>
> Two possible scenarios using common technology. Both would
> satisfy my needs. The price difference is a factor of around
> 5. The intermittent system with give me higher profits, less
> initial cash outflow and the same quality end product,
> plants and fish.
>
> Marc S. Nameth
>
Marc,
Touche, old man! And thanks!
I was hoping you would come to that conclusion. I have been thinking along
the same lines and, based on the quality of your previous posts, I feel
confident that my own hunches in this area have just been validated- .
I believe the devices and designs and architecture that we can use to move
air and water with are critical to the efficient operation of the solar
powered system. I believe we must go back and question many of our
predisposed notions of how to do something - Question Assumptions. I am
working on that for my new location
Ted
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Subject: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
From: Marc & Marcy
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 18:23:46 -0600
> Touche, old man! And thanks!
>
> I was hoping you would come to that conclusion. I have been thinking along
> the same lines and, based on the quality of your previous posts, I feel
> confident that my own hunches in this area have just been validated- .
> Ted
Thanks for the compliments, this was a team effort.
The information from you, Adrianna, the Speraneo's and many,
many others went a looong way toward giving me sources and
concepts to reach those conclusions. There's no substitute
for good info, advice and support from people who know the
buisiness.
Marc S. Nameth
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Subject: Re: cold
From: "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 18:19:59 -0600
It should work even there. You could insulate everything except where you
want the sun to come in with straw bales, or use a pit or partial pit to
moderate the temperatures (the Earth is much warmer than the outside air in
such conditions). You can also go with solar hydronics for heating, or a
solar water bag wall as described in the Solviva book (they built a
greenhouse in the cold New England area using that system and never needed
auxillary heat). Also Tom at S&S mentioned they have only needed extra heat
a few days a year - the black Tilapia tanks act as passive solar thermal
mass - they're not nearly as cold as you, but they also haven't done
EVERYTHING possible for solar heat gain, because they don't need to. Just
make sure you have a non-electric back up heat source and generator in case
of Y2k or winter storm power outages.
Jewel
----- Original Message -----
From: JB
To:
Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 5:12 PM
Subject: cold
Hello Group
I live in Calgary, Alberta, Canada and am interested in starting an
aquaponics system. I have purchased the package from S&S but am concerned
with the viability of such a project in our harsh climate. Our temperatures
can range from 30C in summer to -30C in winter. Hail is also a concern
here. Is there anyone out there who has experience with this type of
scenareo? Any info/insight would be appreciated!
Thanks,
jb
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Subject: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
From: "Jewel" <1mastiff@amigo.net>
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 18:31:42 -0600
> I recently did a study on solar electricity for aquaponics
> pumping purposes. It is a viable and economical idea for an
> intermittent pumping system. We are implementing it here as
> we use the S&S paradigm which has an intermittent pumping
> system.
>
Marc, we are about to sign a lease on a $132,000 PV system to run our off
grid experimental greenhouses and farm. It will produce 32 to 40 Kwh per
day, which is what we figured we needed to power 6 nodes of the S&S system,
and household needs (which are minor in comparison). I've worked on various
scenarios to cut energy and make the system more passive, which we will be
experimenting with, but we can't afford to experiment with everything
because financial needs require we get a commercial operation successfully
running asap. So I figure keeping as close to what really works for sure is
important, while we try experimental methods with another greenhouse. We
have determined that we can cut the pumping cycle time down to an hour, and
still be in a safe zone. But if you know of any ways we can cut down the
power demands and still be assured of a working commercial operation, please
let me know as soon as you can.
Jewel
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Subject: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
From: Marc & Marcy
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 20:19:24 -0600
But if you know of any ways we can cut down the
> power demands and still be assured of a working commercial operation, please
> let me know as soon as you can.
The rule is that ALL systems have losses. This means yours
do also. You also have a lot of control over losses.
I will assume you are getting 115V and 230 V from your
leased PV system and you may not modify it nor is DC power
available to you. Please correct me if my assumptions are
off as a direct DC connection may give further energy
savings.
Are you running your pumps in the most efficient part of
their curve? I typically will find a beautiful 75 to 90 plus
percent capable system running at 25 to 50 percent or worse.
Did you select an efficient or the most efficient pump,
manufacturer or model for your application?
Blowers and fans are pumps, air pumps. They can be operated
in the most or least efficient part of their operating
curve. See above.
Some pump/blower/fan designs have integral motors so a more
efficient motor or pump/blower/fan cannot be installed.
Some pump/blower/fan designs have separable motors so a more
efficient motor or pump/blower/fan can be installed.
All lighting is not created equal. Some technologies are
more efficient than others. In many cases energy savings may
be appreciable.
Losses occur in wiring. These are called I squared R losses.
They show up as heat. Does your wiring have enough
"ampacity" or circular mil area to handle the expected
current.
Did the wiring design take into account motor start up
surges that may take 3 to 8 times the starting current than
normal running current?
Higher efficiencies are cheaper to attain with higher
voltage components since wire size can be smaller since
higher voltage means less current so a smaller circular mil
area is needed.
The same size wire , if rated for it, can be used to carry
higher voltage to a 230 volt motor in place of a 115 volt
motor. Less power loss in the wire as the current need is
halved.
Intelligent motor controllers can be used to run a pump or
blower motor. If properly selected and setup they can
provide significant efficiency gains over a direct hook-up.
A major public electric utility in the Denver, CO area was
giving major rebates to companies that added motor
controllers to the air conditioner, pumping and other plants
AND the controllers and labor did NOT come from the utility.
This was cheaper than adding generating capacity.
Automatic pneumatic door closers are recommended to lower
heat losses and need no electricity to work.
There are Freon operated shutters that automatically open in
sunlight and close towards dark without electricity with the
purpose of automatically insulating your structure.
The same type of technology mentioned above is also used to
open vents to allow passive cooling when temperatures rise
too high in the structure, again without electricity.
Passive heat collection schemes abound that use vertical
elevation distance to cause air and coolant flow by
convection rather than pumps or blowers.
Some of the techniques mentioned above are as old as the
hills but only recently have been affordable for other than
the federal government.
Solar rechargeable flashlights are good for night
inspections and short chores.
All appliances in your home are not created energy
efficiency equal.
If you MUST use nightlites then the solid state guys are
more efficient than the incandescent ones.
Do you NEED all the little indicator, clock, phone, night,
etc. lights you may have around?
Blow dryers, microwaves and irons use a LOT of power.
Candles are cool.
Kerosene lamps are cool but stink.
My cat has a cold and sneezed on me. Gross.
Marc
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Subject: Power Conservation
From: Dave Miller
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 22:55:07 -0400
Marc (and Marcy),
> Candles are cool.
Your latest post really got me thinking. I don't own nor use the
equipment to run a full scale greenhouse yet I do have a very small
organic farm on 1 acre. (Time will
come).
Your advice on finding the most efficient means applies to us all.
Whether solar, wind, geothermal, radiant, we can always find more
passive ways to efficiently utilize the energy around us. So much is
available yet the info is often overlooked. I am sure you have stirred
up a few tinders in the fire to remind us all that we need to reclaim
the simpler of methods.
Dave, the one who recycles maximally
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Subject: Re: Inflation Fans, In or Out?
From: PDOSSJR
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 23:17:19 EDT
In a message dated 10/26/99 6:32:59 PM Central Daylight Time,
ground@thrifty.net writes:
<< A continuous duty battery operated fan/pumping/charging
> system cannot work unless you have photovoltaic capacity
> that can charge batteries AND run the fans simultaneously.
> This is a horrendously expensive system.
>
> A intermittent fan/pumping system can work with batteries if
> the photovoltaics can produce enough battery recharge to
> power your fans between fan cycles. Significantly fewer
> photovoltaics than the continuously run system. >>
Anyone thinking of going solar or any alternative energy should plan on
getting/building one of the small engine/alternater chargers. They are
relatively inexpensive and give you a lot of power when you need it (no sun,
wind, etc.). They also allow you to start small and add more array as you
go. Also, unless you have a huge array, they are necessary for battery
equalization that must be done every month or two. There is a lot to know
about deep cycle batteries to get the most life out of them. A regular
generator is really over kill for battery charging since the deep cycle
batteries should only be charged between 10-20% of their amp hr rating.
Paul
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Subject: Interesting Aquaculture Articles
From: Marc & Marcy
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 22:11:59 -0600
A couple of trend setters I thought:
http://www.purefood.org/Patent/gefish.cfm
http://www.aquaculturemag.com/html/hardy.html
http://www.purefood.org/ge/plotdownbio.cfm
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