Aquaponics Digest - Sun 05/27/01

Message   1: Re: Hi All
             from "Chris G" 

Message   2: McLaughlin system
             from Jim Joyner 

Message   3: System update
             from Katie Rezendes 

Message   4: Re: McLaughlin system
             from Bertmcl 'at'

Message   5: Re: Hi All
             from "Ada Erickson" 

Message   6: another system update
             from Darren Pearce 

Message   7: RE: another system update/ a mention of growth
             from Darren Pearce 

Message   8: Re: TOP TEN FOODS, was: another system update
             from "TGTX" 

Message   9: Re: Tough Love for Steve

             from "STEVE SPRING" 

Message  10: Re: Intro/Background and a question
             from "STEVE SPRING" 

Message  11: Re: Hi All
             from "STEVE SPRING" 

| Message 1  

Subject: Re: Hi All
From:    "Chris G" 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 09:04:51 -0400

Hi Marc,

Thanks, I'm glad to hear that.  A lot of groups on the net, blast newbies 
for asking basic questions without reading the FAQ. Which I really don't 
like, it impedes learning.  I have had tropical fish aquarium for years, I 
guess the much larger scale just makes it feel different.  Anyways, I glad 
to hear people are here to learn and share thier knowledge.


>From: marc 'at'
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at'
>To: aquaponics 'at'
>Subject: Re: Hi All
>Date: Sat, 26 May 2001 10:26:54 -0600
>Chris G wrote:
> >
> > Hi All,
> >
> > Just joined the list and hoping to learn a great deal from everyone.  Is
> > there a FAQ for aquaponics (yet)?
>Archives at:
> > I'm sure we newbies all ask the same
> > questions over and over again.
> > If not, then is there a need for one?  If
> > there is a need, I would consider doing it, using the answers to all my
> > questions!
>If all newbies were blazing introverts then all old
>aquaponikers would be also and this group would not exist.
>I'm currently considering quitting my new job as the
>corporate culture is one of "figure it out and don't bother
>anyone". I like to discuss and talk things over to learn
>from others mistakes rather than just reading "histories".
>It's also wonderful to have community and social contact -
>except for STEVE of course (just kidding - Steve's fun and
>teases well)

>ANYWAY, This may sound a bit crazy but look at BASIC rules
>for starting an INDOOR domestic tropical fish aquarium.
>Fish is fish is fish.

| Message 2  

Subject: McLaughlin system
From:    Jim Joyner 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 08:36:49 -0500


What was your reasoning for using 6" deep grow beds instead of 12"? Do you 
think the shallow beds will be just as effective for all plants or just 
some (like flowers)?



| Message 3  

Subject: System update
From:    Katie Rezendes 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 14:03:39 -0400

Hello Group

It's been a while since I first joined the group and a lot has been
going on in our life, so I have not spent much time writing in, so I
felt it was time to bring you guys up to speed.

In January I started building a 40 gal system modeled after the S & S
system. I designed it to fit in the corner of my dining room, since we
had no greenhouse. I have a 100 gal oval tank with 40 gallons of water
and 18 nile tilapia. My grow beds measure 2' x 4' x 8". In the beginning
every thing went great, all my seeds germinated in half the normal
germination time (tomatoes, lettuce, carrots, beans, and some basil). I
also took a cutting off of a house plant that was dying and it seemed to
root within three days. The seedlings became very leggy, I decided it
was do to a lack of light, so I began constructing a 10'x12' solar
greenhouse in our back yard. Since then we have been enjoying fresh
salad very often, my basil looks and smells great, the tomatoes are 5'
high and have fruit already, and I have pulled out some baby carrots at
about 3" long. We are very happy with the way every thing is going.

I just found out last week that I will be loosing my job in October. I
feel at this time that I would like to follow my dream and start a
commercial green house. If anyone has any startup pep talk it would be a
big help. I am thinking of salad mix, not really sure ware to start. If
there is anyone out there that would  be willing to let me visit a
similar operation that would be great.

Thank in advance for any and all replies.

Kevin Rezendes
Portsmouth, RI

| Message 4  

Subject: Re: McLaughlin system
From:    Bertmcl 'at'
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 14:58:22 EDT

Jim,  Primary was the extra cost and after talking with Paula she thought 
that 6" would be fine.Whwn this test is over in October 2001, I plan to move 
the beds inside a greenhouse and that will be only about half as much gravel 
to move. With 12" deep beds you should be able to grow almost any AQUAPONIC 
crops. The grant was not enough to include a greenhouse, and I was told if I 
could make the system work outdoors, then I should be able to do more in a 
greenhouse. A farmer gave my wife a few Tomato & Green Pepper plants, which I 
set out in the end of 2 beds alond with some Kale seeds. When I shut down the 
system after3 hard frosts the 4'  plus high Tomato plant still had 52 
tomatoes ranging from 2-3" in dia, the kale plant has root ball 2' in 
diameter, a 36' plant spread and was 2' tall all in a 6" bed.


| Message 5  

Subject: Re: Hi All
From:    "Ada Erickson" 
Date:    Mon, 28 May 2001 00:09:44 -0000


Funny you should ask.  I too am a new person, and I was flabbergasted with 
the openness and community spirit on this board, so I am working with others 
to immortalize some of the information that is shared here.

So what you and I need is "coming soon"

There is an Intro page that is in it's first few days.  It is at  so you can get to know a few people 
and their areas of expertise.

Please send me your bio.



>From: "Chris G" 
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at'
>To: aquaponics 'at'
>Subject: Hi All
>Date: Sat, 26 May 2001 08:08:53 -0400
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>X-Originating-IP: []
>Received: from [] by (3.2) with ESMTP id 
>MHotMailBCD8E7DC005F40043750CF12E003137B0; Sat May 26 05:09:04 2001
>Received: from (unverified []) by 
> (Rockliffe SMTPRA 4.2.4) with ESMTP id 
> for ; Sat, 26 
>May 2001 07:01:05 -0500
>Received: from mail pickup service by with Microsoft SMTPSVC; 
>Sat, 26 May 2001 05:08:53 -0700
>Received: from by with HTTP;  Sat, 
>26 May 2001 12:08:53 GMT
>From snsaquasys 'at' Sat May 26 05:09:30 2001
>X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 May 2001 12:08:53.0289 (UTC) 
>Sender: aquaponics-request 'at'
>Hi All,
>Just joined the list and hoping to learn a great deal from everyone.  Is
>there a FAQ for aquaponics (yet)?  I'm sure we newbies all ask the same
>questions over and over again.  If not, then is there a need for one?  If
>there is a need, I would consider doing it, using the answers to all my
>questions!  :)  Thanks
>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at

| Message 6  

Subject: another system update
From:    Darren Pearce 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 22:31:18 -0400

Wow! 2 weeks has passed since our first module came online and things are 
going great!
The unit consist of (so far) a 45 gallon aquarium, a 4'x4' plastic lined table 
and (16) individual 6" pots.Each pot is filled with 1" lava rock and is  
continuously top-fed using open 1/4" line.A single hagen 802 aquarium pump 
provides enough water flow for 2 such tables.50 common feeder goldfish ranging 
from 5" to 1" do what goldfish do best and appear happy (ok, hungry) and 
The inductees include head lettuces, leaf lettuces, basil, a couple of pepper 
vars and a couple of tomatoes as well.My personal favorite (drum roll 
. a cantaloupe that seems to be doing quite well.Time will tell I 
Sometime in the near future, We'll be hanging a 4" irrigation tube module off 
of the north wall.This move will almost surely require another pump.A 50 
gallon poly barrel stands as a backup fish tank if required.

I'm sure the unexpected push is unsettling, but best of luck in the endeavor.I 
can't help but think that market farming using this methodology would be a 
vastly rewarding experience.


| Message 7  

Subject: RE: another system update/ a mention of growth
From:    Darren Pearce 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 23:07:54 -0400

Please pardon Me, in My excitement I neglected to mention how happy We are 
with the growth that We're seeing.
We've seen head lettuce go from 3-4 leaf plantlets to 8" wide plants with  
nearly 2" heads(with roots already emerging from the bottoms of the pots), a 
jalapeno type pepper out-pace it's soil borne counterparts by 50% or more, a 
teeny 3" cherry tomato seedling explode to almost 1' tall and 18" wide and you 

the cantaloupe (also out-pacing it's counterpart)

Note: The PH of the system slowly drops into the high 5's every few days and 
I've been using worm casting tea to boost it back into low 6's.
I've also started a micro crop of barley to use against a potential algae 
problem.I planted a 10" pot last week and already have a herd of 3-4 inch 

I'm looking for a source of fish food beside the local pet store.Can someone 
make a recommendation? Thanks.


| Message 8  

Subject: Re: TOP TEN FOODS, was: another system update
From:    "TGTX" 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 23:36:33 -0500

> vars and a couple of tomatoes as well.My personal favorite (drum roll
> please)
. a cantaloupe that seems to be doing quite well.Time will tell I
> suppose

Drum roll with a resounding cymbal crash!!  You are, of course, approaching
Aquaponics Valhalla when you say you are growing Cantaloupe. Please enter
the gates of horticultural blessings and benevolence with all due respect.

The Magnificent Cantaloupe

.is one of my ultimate top ten hallowed
"fruits" to grow for the human diet in an aquaponics, or any other type of
homestead agriculture system.
One has not lived to the max

or even to the median

if one has not
chomped on a good homegrown melon

The smells and the flavors in the melon
flesh of so many varieties are subtle and complex, and simple all at the
same time

.(boy does THAT sound like B.S. or what???)

anyway, whatever
that means

Of course the Israelis are on the cutting edge of the most
excellent melon cultivars and culture methods.
Here are the top ten FRUITS, in case any of you have forgotten from last


1. Papaya (the wife can't stand em

how can one explain this?)
2. Cantaloupe
3. Strawberries
4. Oranges
5. Tangerines
6. Kiwis (Wife says, "Yeah

 Oh yeah"

.me like too!)
7. Mangos (not even on the wife's radar, and she lived in Mexico for
.go figure!!)
8. Apricots (can't grow them here, not cold enough, drat the luck
the JAM)
9. Persimmons (don't even ask how persimmons scored better than
.just go with it

just work with me here!!!)
10. Watermelons (yes indeed

get it all over ya, and spit the seeds at the
lightnin' bugs in the cool of the evenin' across the new mowed lawn, in a
mid summer nights' dream)


1. Sweet Potato (could eat them every day

.with Tilapia on the same
.is great)
2. Carrots (yes indeed, steamed, roasted, juiced, added to the pot roast, or
as a pair, inserted vertically beneath the upper lip to give the kids a wild
hoot in one of my rare walrus imitations.)
3. Spinach, Cooked (I'm strong to the finish

Uck, uck, uck

4. Collard Greens (I'm a Soul Man
with a wee bit o' bacon
.I love

wife can't stand it)
5. Red Bell Peppers, Raw

(roasted, dipped in ranch dressing,
6. Kale (o.k. as a supplement in potato soup, otherwise

ornamental in my
7. Dandelion Greens (Don't ask, I'm just a reporter here
8. Spinach, Raw (Oh yeah

spinach salad with some Feda cheese and
9. Broccoli (Steamed with a little olive oil drizzled
.& parmesean shaved
on top
10. Brussel Sprouts (my spouse will leave the house
.again, go figure).


1. Soybeans (Mentioned in my FAVORITE MOVIE OF ALL TIME
.It's a Wonderful
2. Pinto Beans (Surprised?

Blazing Saddles
.Nuff Said)
3. Chickpeas or Garbanzos (Hummus, anyone? YUMM!!!
also makes great
4. Lentils (Oh, man, I could go all day without thinking about lentils,
unless we're talking sprouts
.I would pass on lentils every day of the
week, unless some wonderful Jewish grandma offers me some nice hot lentil
soup, then I fold my hands and thank the Lord for the good grub)
5. Cranberry Beans
6. Black-eyed Peas (Now you're talkin' my language
.truely Texas Soul Food)
7. Pink Beans (for Communist Sympathizers and "Exquisite" Chefs, no doubt)
8. Navy Beans (My Daddy was in the Navy and my Moma fixed these from time to
time with a little piece of bacon in the pan

I never cared for them as a
kid, until I got my mind right
.now I love them if fixed properly
me wanna splash on some Old Spice after a close shave, pull up anchor and
leave port, if you know what I mean
9. Black Beans (A staple in our diet for the last 25 years or so

the best
in my opinion
with onions, cilantro, and sour cream topping)
10. Small white beans (how these differ from Navy beans, I am not
.don't ask)


1. Quinoa (Pronounced "Keen-wa"

from our Inca brothers and
.absolutely great in a cassarole with cheese, potatoes &

gotta soak & rinse the bitter saponin coating off the grain,
2.  Macaroni or spaghetti, whole wheat

.(Yeah, baby
.its a beautiful
3.  Amaranth (From our Aztec bro's an siss'es
.makes a heck of a bread or
4.  Buckwheat Groats (In the bulk aisle of Whole Foods

never touch the
stuff, man).
5. Spinach spaghetti

.(Yeah, baby, like totally

spinach fettuchini del
mare & shrimp)
6.  Bulgar (now we're talkin'
.Tabouli w/ mint is one of my faves
the wife
7. Pearled Barley (I love this in a hearty beef and broccoli soup in the
8. Wild rice (How can you go wrong here? Subtle and complex
9. Millet (Sorry, no extensive experience here, except for a bland breakfast
mush we made as naive babies in college in some kinda stupid "solidarity"
with some kinda group that we knew nothing about
.song birds like it, so it
can't be all bad)
10. Brown Rice
.same as wild

Source: Science in the Public Interest.  Scoring system based on vitamin,
mineral, fat content, "complete protein" characteristics, etc.  Reprinted in
part from "Dr. Bob Arnot's Guide to Turning Back the Clock", with poetic
license, and provocative & ridiculous commentary from yours truely.

Tally Ho!!

| Message 9  

Subject: Re: Tough Love for Steve

From:    "STEVE SPRING" 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 23:41:21 -0500

Hi Devon,

We all have our opinions.

I'm a long way from being perfect, but I am what I am. I do appreciate your
input. I accept criticism as well as praise.

As far as your current environment. Usually, we choose to be where we are.
I, also, spent almost 15 years in the jungles of SE Asia. I have also seen
very similar situations to that boy spearing 4 muddy-tasting Tilapia
much worse.

If I offended you, I apologize. (Or am I not supposed to do that now?)

Take care

Steve :)

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 4:54 AM
Subject: OT: Tough Love for Steve

> Hi Devon,
> I sometimes feel like the "whipping boy"!
> I, in no way, meant to belittle your project. 
> I'm currently redoing my entire system as well. I finally got those
"damned" tomatos to grow and now they are taking over everything.

Hi Steve!!

Im sorry mate, but I have to say something here
. I cant hold it
I too used to be called "socially insensitive" in my field, but simply
because I used to keep young engineers out of whorehouses, bars, drugs,
give them alternatives
. (cook up a good dinner myself for 30 guys
or go on a weekend rail trip in the country!!)to the seedy underworld of
drugs and alchohol while we were working on projects all over the
. so I do know how it is working 14 hr shifts I can relate
that my friend for 3-4 months at a time in many a time HOSTILE
. dig working with a gas mask on your hip
.or having a
guy with a submachine gun personally guard your every move, or being
sprayed with a volley of bullets at yet another site ??

My wife has too just opted to leave North American ER (Emergency Room)
nursing to come back here with me so I know how "wound up" one gets in
the weird and wacky world of your high stress job but hey man
.like I
had to tell her sometimes after a long especially hard night
. "I am
NOT your enemy, calm down!!"

Now what has gotten me ticked off?? WEll one of the things I nearly sent
a guy home about is his constant swearing over things
 try building a
factory in monsoon rains where 3 times you have to pump out electrical
channels by hand like a paddy field and then have guys swearing about
how bad things are
.tensions run so high it is like MUTINY.
Please please please Steve
. differentiate between tomatoes, Mike Sipe,
tilapia and US as a group.
Your damning of the tomatoes has really gotten my gall
 like I said to
that young green engineer back then
.at the risk of sending him home,
"start BLESSING something around here and you may notice a
.!!" He was stunned
So as a joke guys started to insert the word "blessed" in place of every
swear word.'What a blessed piece of steel that just fell on my toe
'what a blessed rainy day it is
.we get to pump the channels again
'What a blessed meal we just had with chopsticks
.at least we were able
to sit for once for an hour at lunch'
. etc

This began to turn a mood of mutiny around to a feeling of humour and
.because who wants to touch something damned??

Please do not take out your emotions on the plants, people or the fish

or even the group
. remember there is a feel or tone to every
newsgroup, and instead of apologising and being sorry for everything,
how about just NOT saying these offensive things here?? It is my humble
opinion that this group was formed to SEEK solutions, and not for folks
who want to just "cuss" out their frustration. Long before you I have
seen people networking in this list on the hour almost in rapid flurries
of posts from folks trying to save not a few hundred, but thousands of
so BELIEVE when people say U haven't seen or been there till you
kill a few thousand fish!
A lot of folks have done MUCH worse than you man
.and have come back to
do much better
. and have used this list to constructively SOLVE, HELP,
and DOCUMENT as a lasting POSITIVE contribution, a record of WHAT NOT TO
DO!! But even that needs to be done in a way that will inspire the
newbies, not discourage them! One farm I visited recently overseas moved
in the space of 15 mins from viable farm one minute to a loss of 35'000
almost grown out fish. This group then moved in solidarity in a similar
occasion to help one person dispose of the carcasses, and yes man did
that guy make it big in the biogas business!! He used a bacterial
(also suggested from this humble group
decompose his fish!

I find your cursing  of things offensive, and not because of my belief
systems, but because I think most of us are on this group are here to
make BLESSED good lettuce, BLESSED good fish, (even if they originated
with Mike Sipe!! ) and make BLESSED good at whatever we put our hand to.
What I trying to say is
.MOVE ON man
. dont damn
I am sure that many folks feel like I do on this
 anything damned
deserves a valued position in my dustbin, outside BURNED, or on the

If U think everything U do is so poor then get out of it Steve!If you
approach ornamental fish growing with the same attitude then you will
again be seeking scapegoats
. and who will it be then?? In all your
dealings with fish, lettuce, your lack of sleep, your aquaponic system,
your growbeds, and all the variables thereof, there is only ONE
CONSTANT, and that is YOU!! (I say all this in love my friend! - Tough
) Being consequent means taking responsibility and being
accountable for our own actions and inactions.
Think about it.
PS. Any day U think your endeavours are so poor, I extend a invitation
to you here to see a poor boy heading home after spending a whole day
spearing a whole string of muddy tasting 4 inch tilapia, with a bunch of
scraggly greens to put in his Mothers hands, and  with a few sticks of
sugarcane to wash it down

. and I would ask you to say "Big catch
mon!! " to him and see the smile that would spread across his face
slowly but surely
. radiating ear to ear

and then you know I THINK
your attempts would seem slowly not too bad after all
. the glass is
either half empty or its half full, 

its all relative

its all
relative mon.


| Message 10 

Subject: Re: Intro/Background and a question
From:    "STEVE SPRING" 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 23:43:47 -0500



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "gutierrez-lagatta" 
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 5:40 AM
Subject: Re: Intro/Background and a question

Steve (Alias SIS),
Reproduction seems to be a problem in your operation, first your fish
hatch like crazy and take over your tank; now your tomatoes.  If I
were you I'd watch my wife like a hawk :>)
.make sure all birth
control is operational.:>)


> I'm currently redoing my entire system as well. I finally got those
> tomatos to grow and now they are taking over everything.

| Message 11 

Subject: Re: Hi All
From:    "STEVE SPRING" 
Date:    Sun, 27 May 2001 23:59:45 -0500

"DITTO" to the "AMEN"!

She puts up with me doesn't she??


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "TGTX" 
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: Hi All

> Screamer types are occasionally dealt with by the Paula
> moderator person when non-entertaining but heavy handed she
> is not. Best darn moderator around!
> Marc

Amen to that, Yoda.

Back to Index