Aquaponics Digest - Sun 05/27/01
Message 1: Re: Hi All
from "Chris G"
Message 2: McLaughlin system
from Jim Joyner
Message 3: System update
from Katie Rezendes
Message 4: Re: McLaughlin system
from Bertmcl 'at' aol.com
Message 5: Re: Hi All
from "Ada Erickson"
Message 6: another system update
from Darren Pearce
Message 7: RE: another system update/ a mention of growth
from Darren Pearce
Message 8: Re: TOP TEN FOODS, was: another system update
from "TGTX"
Message 9: Re: Tough Love for Steve
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 10: Re: Intro/Background and a question
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 11: Re: Hi All
from "STEVE SPRING"
| Message 1
Subject: Re: Hi All
From: "Chris G"
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 09:04:51 -0400
Hi Marc,
Thanks, I'm glad to hear that. A lot of groups on the net, blast newbies
for asking basic questions without reading the FAQ. Which I really don't
like, it impedes learning. I have had tropical fish aquarium for years, I
guess the much larger scale just makes it feel different. Anyways, I glad
to hear people are here to learn and share thier knowledge.
Christopher
>From: marc 'at' aculink.net
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: Hi All
>Date: Sat, 26 May 2001 10:26:54 -0600
>
>Chris G wrote:
> >
> > Hi All,
> >
> > Just joined the list and hoping to learn a great deal from everyone. Is
> > there a FAQ for aquaponics (yet)?
>
>Archives at:
>
>http://www.i55mall.com/aquaponics/
>
> > I'm sure we newbies all ask the same
> > questions over and over again.
> > If not, then is there a need for one? If
> > there is a need, I would consider doing it, using the answers to all my
> > questions!
>
>If all newbies were blazing introverts then all old
>aquaponikers would be also and this group would not exist.
>I'm currently considering quitting my new job as the
>corporate culture is one of "figure it out and don't bother
>anyone". I like to discuss and talk things over to learn
>from others mistakes rather than just reading "histories".
>It's also wonderful to have community and social contact -
>except for STEVE of course (just kidding - Steve's fun and
>teases well)
>
>ANYWAY, This may sound a bit crazy but look at BASIC rules
>for starting an INDOOR domestic tropical fish aquarium.
>
>Fish is fish is fish.
>Snip>
>Marc
| Message 2
Subject: McLaughlin system
From: Jim Joyner
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 08:36:49 -0500
Bert,
What was your reasoning for using 6" deep grow beds instead of 12"? Do you
think the shallow beds will be just as effective for all plants or just
some (like flowers)?
Thanks,
Jim
| Message 3
Subject: System update
From: Katie Rezendes
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 14:03:39 -0400
Hello Group
It's been a while since I first joined the group and a lot has been
going on in our life, so I have not spent much time writing in, so I
felt it was time to bring you guys up to speed.
In January I started building a 40 gal system modeled after the S & S
system. I designed it to fit in the corner of my dining room, since we
had no greenhouse. I have a 100 gal oval tank with 40 gallons of water
and 18 nile tilapia. My grow beds measure 2' x 4' x 8". In the beginning
every thing went great, all my seeds germinated in half the normal
germination time (tomatoes, lettuce, carrots, beans, and some basil). I
also took a cutting off of a house plant that was dying and it seemed to
root within three days. The seedlings became very leggy, I decided it
was do to a lack of light, so I began constructing a 10'x12' solar
greenhouse in our back yard. Since then we have been enjoying fresh
salad very often, my basil looks and smells great, the tomatoes are 5'
high and have fruit already, and I have pulled out some baby carrots at
about 3" long. We are very happy with the way every thing is going.
I just found out last week that I will be loosing my job in October. I
feel at this time that I would like to follow my dream and start a
commercial green house. If anyone has any startup pep talk it would be a
big help. I am thinking of salad mix, not really sure ware to start. If
there is anyone out there that would be willing to let me visit a
similar operation that would be great.
Thank in advance for any and all replies.
Kevin Rezendes
Portsmouth, RI
| Message 4
Subject: Re: McLaughlin system
From: Bertmcl 'at' aol.com
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 14:58:22 EDT
Jim, Primary was the extra cost and after talking with Paula she thought
that 6" would be fine.Whwn this test is over in October 2001, I plan to move
the beds inside a greenhouse and that will be only about half as much gravel
to move. With 12" deep beds you should be able to grow almost any AQUAPONIC
crops. The grant was not enough to include a greenhouse, and I was told if I
could make the system work outdoors, then I should be able to do more in a
greenhouse. A farmer gave my wife a few Tomato & Green Pepper plants, which I
set out in the end of 2 beds alond with some Kale seeds. When I shut down the
system after3 hard frosts the 4' plus high Tomato plant still had 52
tomatoes ranging from 2-3" in dia, the kale plant has root ball 2' in
diameter, a 36' plant spread and was 2' tall all in a 6" bed.
Bert
| Message 5
Subject: Re: Hi All
From: "Ada Erickson"
Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 00:09:44 -0000
Welcome;
Funny you should ask. I too am a new person, and I was flabbergasted with
the openness and community spirit on this board, so I am working with others
to immortalize some of the information that is shared here.
So what you and I need is "coming soon"
There is an Intro page that is in it's first few days. It is at
www.primadonnasrevenge.com/aquaponics/ so you can get to know a few people
and their areas of expertise.
Please send me your bio.
Thanks
Ada
>From: "Chris G"
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Hi All
>Date: Sat, 26 May 2001 08:08:53 -0400
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>
>Hi All,
>
>Just joined the list and hoping to learn a great deal from everyone. Is
>there a FAQ for aquaponics (yet)? I'm sure we newbies all ask the same
>questions over and over again. If not, then is there a need for one? If
>there is a need, I would consider doing it, using the answers to all my
>questions! :) Thanks
>
>Christopher
>
__________
>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
| Message 6
Subject: another system update
From: Darren Pearce
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 22:31:18 -0400
Wow! 2 weeks has passed since our first module came online and things are
going great!
The unit consist of (so far) a 45 gallon aquarium, a 4'x4' plastic lined table
and (16) individual 6" pots.Each pot is filled with 1" lava rock and is
continuously top-fed using open 1/4" line.A single hagen 802 aquarium pump
provides enough water flow for 2 such tables.50 common feeder goldfish ranging
from 5" to 1" do what goldfish do best and appear happy (ok, hungry) and
healthy.
The inductees include head lettuces, leaf lettuces, basil, a couple of pepper
vars and a couple of tomatoes as well.My personal favorite (drum roll
please)
. a cantaloupe that seems to be doing quite well.Time will tell I
suppose.
Sometime in the near future, We'll be hanging a 4" irrigation tube module off
of the north wall.This move will almost surely require another pump.A 50
gallon poly barrel stands as a backup fish tank if required.
Kevin
I'm sure the unexpected push is unsettling, but best of luck in the endeavor.I
can't help but think that market farming using this methodology would be a
vastly rewarding experience.
Darren
| Message 7
Subject: RE: another system update/ a mention of growth
From: Darren Pearce
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 23:07:54 -0400
Please pardon Me, in My excitement I neglected to mention how happy We are
with the growth that We're seeing.
We've seen head lettuce go from 3-4 leaf plantlets to 8" wide plants with
nearly 2" heads(with roots already emerging from the bottoms of the pots), a
jalapeno type pepper out-pace it's soil borne counterparts by 50% or more, a
teeny 3" cherry tomato seedling explode to almost 1' tall and 18" wide and you
know
the cantaloupe (also out-pacing it's counterpart)
.LOL
Note: The PH of the system slowly drops into the high 5's every few days and
I've been using worm casting tea to boost it back into low 6's.
I've also started a micro crop of barley to use against a potential algae
problem.I planted a 10" pot last week and already have a herd of 3-4 inch
blades.
I'm looking for a source of fish food beside the local pet store.Can someone
make a recommendation? Thanks.
Darren
| Message 8
Subject: Re: TOP TEN FOODS, was: another system update
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 23:36:33 -0500
> vars and a couple of tomatoes as well.My personal favorite (drum roll
> please)
. a cantaloupe that seems to be doing quite well.Time will tell I
> suppose
Drum roll with a resounding cymbal crash!! You are, of course, approaching
Aquaponics Valhalla when you say you are growing Cantaloupe. Please enter
the gates of horticultural blessings and benevolence with all due respect.
The Magnificent Cantaloupe
.is one of my ultimate top ten hallowed
"fruits" to grow for the human diet in an aquaponics, or any other type of
homestead agriculture system.
One has not lived to the max
or even to the median
if one has not
chomped on a good homegrown melon
The smells and the flavors in the melon
flesh of so many varieties are subtle and complex, and simple all at the
same time
.(boy does THAT sound like B.S. or what???)
anyway, whatever
that means
Of course the Israelis are on the cutting edge of the most
excellent melon cultivars and culture methods.
Here are the top ten FRUITS, in case any of you have forgotten from last
time:
FRUIT HALL OF FAME:
1. Papaya (the wife can't stand em
how can one explain this?)
2. Cantaloupe
3. Strawberries
4. Oranges
5. Tangerines
6. Kiwis (Wife says, "Yeah
Oh yeah"
.me like too!)
7. Mangos (not even on the wife's radar, and she lived in Mexico for
years
.go figure!!)
8. Apricots (can't grow them here, not cold enough, drat the luck
.I LOVE
the JAM)
9. Persimmons (don't even ask how persimmons scored better than
Watermelon
.just go with it
just work with me here!!!)
10. Watermelons (yes indeed
get it all over ya, and spit the seeds at the
lightnin' bugs in the cool of the evenin' across the new mowed lawn, in a
mid summer nights' dream)
VEGETABLE VAHALLA:
1. Sweet Potato (could eat them every day
.with Tilapia on the same
plate
.is great)
2. Carrots (yes indeed, steamed, roasted, juiced, added to the pot roast, or
as a pair, inserted vertically beneath the upper lip to give the kids a wild
hoot in one of my rare walrus imitations.)
3. Spinach, Cooked (I'm strong to the finish
Uck, uck, uck
Olive!)
4. Collard Greens (I'm a Soul Man
with a wee bit o' bacon
.I love
it
wife can't stand it)
5. Red Bell Peppers, Raw
(roasted, dipped in ranch dressing,
salads
.stuffed)
6. Kale (o.k. as a supplement in potato soup, otherwise
ornamental in my
book)
7. Dandelion Greens (Don't ask, I'm just a reporter here
.)
8. Spinach, Raw (Oh yeah
spinach salad with some Feda cheese and
tomatoes!)
9. Broccoli (Steamed with a little olive oil drizzled
.& parmesean shaved
on top
.)
10. Brussel Sprouts (my spouse will leave the house
.again, go figure).
MOST BENEVOLENT BEANS:
1. Soybeans (Mentioned in my FAVORITE MOVIE OF ALL TIME
.It's a Wonderful
Life)
2. Pinto Beans (Surprised?
Blazing Saddles
.Nuff Said)
3. Chickpeas or Garbanzos (Hummus, anyone? YUMM!!!
also makes great
sprouts)
4. Lentils (Oh, man, I could go all day without thinking about lentils,
unless we're talking sprouts
.I would pass on lentils every day of the
week, unless some wonderful Jewish grandma offers me some nice hot lentil
soup, then I fold my hands and thank the Lord for the good grub)
5. Cranberry Beans
.(whatever)
6. Black-eyed Peas (Now you're talkin' my language
.truely Texas Soul Food)
7. Pink Beans (for Communist Sympathizers and "Exquisite" Chefs, no doubt)
8. Navy Beans (My Daddy was in the Navy and my Moma fixed these from time to
time with a little piece of bacon in the pan
I never cared for them as a
kid, until I got my mind right
.now I love them if fixed properly
.makes
me wanna splash on some Old Spice after a close shave, pull up anchor and
leave port, if you know what I mean
)
9. Black Beans (A staple in our diet for the last 25 years or so
the best
in my opinion
with onions, cilantro, and sour cream topping)
10. Small white beans (how these differ from Navy beans, I am not
sure
.don't ask)
TOP TEN GRAND GRAINS/PASTAS:
1. Quinoa (Pronounced "Keen-wa"
from our Inca brothers and
sisters
.absolutely great in a cassarole with cheese, potatoes &
leeks
gotta soak & rinse the bitter saponin coating off the grain,
though)
2. Macaroni or spaghetti, whole wheat
.(Yeah, baby
.its a beautiful
thing)
3. Amaranth (From our Aztec bro's an siss'es
.makes a heck of a bread or
mush).
4. Buckwheat Groats (In the bulk aisle of Whole Foods
never touch the
stuff, man).
5. Spinach spaghetti
.(Yeah, baby, like totally
spinach fettuchini del
mare & shrimp)
6. Bulgar (now we're talkin'
.Tabouli w/ mint is one of my faves
the wife
agrees
.)
7. Pearled Barley (I love this in a hearty beef and broccoli soup in the
winter)
8. Wild rice (How can you go wrong here? Subtle and complex
flavors/textures)
9. Millet (Sorry, no extensive experience here, except for a bland breakfast
mush we made as naive babies in college in some kinda stupid "solidarity"
with some kinda group that we knew nothing about
.song birds like it, so it
can't be all bad)
10. Brown Rice
.same as wild
Source: Science in the Public Interest. Scoring system based on vitamin,
mineral, fat content, "complete protein" characteristics, etc. Reprinted in
part from "Dr. Bob Arnot's Guide to Turning Back the Clock", with poetic
license, and provocative & ridiculous commentary from yours truely.
Tally Ho!!
| Message 9
Subject: Re: Tough Love for Steve
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 23:41:21 -0500
Hi Devon,
We all have our opinions.
I'm a long way from being perfect, but I am what I am. I do appreciate your
input. I accept criticism as well as praise.
As far as your current environment. Usually, we choose to be where we are.
I, also, spent almost 15 years in the jungles of SE Asia. I have also seen
very similar situations to that boy spearing 4 muddy-tasting Tilapia
.&
much worse.
If I offended you, I apologize. (Or am I not supposed to do that now?)
Take care
Steve :)
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 4:54 AM
Subject: OT: Tough Love for Steve
STEVE SPRING wrote:
>
> Hi Devon,
>
> I sometimes feel like the "whipping boy"!
>
> I, in no way, meant to belittle your project.
>
> I'm currently redoing my entire system as well. I finally got those
"damned" tomatos to grow and now they are taking over everything.
Hi Steve!!
Im sorry mate, but I have to say something here
. I cant hold it
back.
I too used to be called "socially insensitive" in my field, but simply
because I used to keep young engineers out of whorehouses, bars, drugs,
give them alternatives
. (cook up a good dinner myself for 30 guys
,
or go on a weekend rail trip in the country!!)to the seedy underworld of
drugs and alchohol while we were working on projects all over the
world
. so I do know how it is working 14 hr shifts I can relate
and
that my friend for 3-4 months at a time in many a time HOSTILE
environments
. dig working with a gas mask on your hip
.or having a
guy with a submachine gun personally guard your every move, or being
sprayed with a volley of bullets at yet another site ??
My wife has too just opted to leave North American ER (Emergency Room)
nursing to come back here with me so I know how "wound up" one gets in
the weird and wacky world of your high stress job but hey man
.like I
had to tell her sometimes after a long especially hard night
. "I am
NOT your enemy, calm down!!"
Now what has gotten me ticked off?? WEll one of the things I nearly sent
a guy home about is his constant swearing over things
try building a
factory in monsoon rains where 3 times you have to pump out electrical
channels by hand like a paddy field and then have guys swearing about
how bad things are
.tensions run so high it is like MUTINY.
Please please please Steve
. differentiate between tomatoes, Mike Sipe,
tilapia and US as a group.
Your damning of the tomatoes has really gotten my gall
like I said to
that young green engineer back then
.at the risk of sending him home,
"start BLESSING something around here and you may notice a
difference
.!!" He was stunned
.
So as a joke guys started to insert the word "blessed" in place of every
swear word.'What a blessed piece of steel that just fell on my toe
.'
'what a blessed rainy day it is
.we get to pump the channels again
.'
'What a blessed meal we just had with chopsticks
.at least we were able
to sit for once for an hour at lunch'
. etc
This began to turn a mood of mutiny around to a feeling of humour and
engagement
.because who wants to touch something damned??
Please do not take out your emotions on the plants, people or the fish
or even the group
. remember there is a feel or tone to every
newsgroup, and instead of apologising and being sorry for everything,
how about just NOT saying these offensive things here?? It is my humble
opinion that this group was formed to SEEK solutions, and not for folks
who want to just "cuss" out their frustration. Long before you I have
seen people networking in this list on the hour almost in rapid flurries
of posts from folks trying to save not a few hundred, but thousands of
fish,
so BELIEVE when people say U haven't seen or been there till you
kill a few thousand fish!
A lot of folks have done MUCH worse than you man
.and have come back to
do much better
. and have used this list to constructively SOLVE, HELP,
and DOCUMENT as a lasting POSITIVE contribution, a record of WHAT NOT TO
DO!! But even that needs to be done in a way that will inspire the
newbies, not discourage them! One farm I visited recently overseas moved
in the space of 15 mins from viable farm one minute to a loss of 35'000
almost grown out fish. This group then moved in solidarity in a similar
occasion to help one person dispose of the carcasses, and yes man did
that guy make it big in the biogas business!! He used a bacterial
solution
(also suggested from this humble group
.) to RAPIDLY
decompose his fish!
I find your cursing of things offensive, and not because of my belief
systems, but because I think most of us are on this group are here to
make BLESSED good lettuce, BLESSED good fish, (even if they originated
with Mike Sipe!! ) and make BLESSED good at whatever we put our hand to.
What I trying to say is
.MOVE ON man
. dont damn
.BLESS!!
I am sure that many folks feel like I do on this
anything damned
deserves a valued position in my dustbin, outside BURNED, or on the
compost!!
If U think everything U do is so poor then get out of it Steve!If you
approach ornamental fish growing with the same attitude then you will
again be seeking scapegoats
. and who will it be then?? In all your
dealings with fish, lettuce, your lack of sleep, your aquaponic system,
your growbeds, and all the variables thereof, there is only ONE
CONSTANT, and that is YOU!! (I say all this in love my friend! - Tough
love
) Being consequent means taking responsibility and being
accountable for our own actions and inactions.
Think about it.
PS. Any day U think your endeavours are so poor, I extend a invitation
to you here to see a poor boy heading home after spending a whole day
spearing a whole string of muddy tasting 4 inch tilapia, with a bunch of
scraggly greens to put in his Mothers hands, and with a few sticks of
sugarcane to wash it down
. and I would ask you to say "Big catch
mon!! " to him and see the smile that would spread across his face
slowly but surely
. radiating ear to ear
and then you know I THINK
your attempts would seem slowly not too bad after all
. the glass is
either half empty or its half full,
its all relative
its all
relative mon.
>
| Message 10
Subject: Re: Intro/Background and a question
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 23:43:47 -0500
"AMEN"!
SS
----- Original Message -----
From: "gutierrez-lagatta"
To:
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 5:40 AM
Subject: Re: Intro/Background and a question
Steve (Alias SIS),
Reproduction seems to be a problem in your operation, first your fish
hatch like crazy and take over your tank; now your tomatoes. If I
were you I'd watch my wife like a hawk :>)
.make sure all birth
control is operational.:>)
Adriana
> I'm currently redoing my entire system as well. I finally got those
"damned"
> tomatos to grow and now they are taking over everything.
| Message 11
Subject: Re: Hi All
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 27 May 2001 23:59:45 -0500
"DITTO" to the "AMEN"!
She puts up with me doesn't she??
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "TGTX"
To:
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: Hi All
> Screamer types are occasionally dealt with by the Paula
> moderator person when non-entertaining but heavy handed she
> is not. Best darn moderator around!
>
> Marc
Amen to that, Yoda.
|
